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Islam and terror

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111. Posted by applegirl (Full Member 144 posts) 10y

Quoting james

I do believe that most of the killings being carried out on muslims are committed by other muslims, not by coalition forces.

What facts do you base this belief of yours on?

112. Posted by Peter (Admin 5807 posts) 10y

Quoting applegirl

The cartoons only worked as a trigger and might seem quite ridicolous in comparison with the wars.

Fair point. Though it still doesn't excuse the behaviour. It's not really much different to the US using September 11 as an excuse to invade Iraq really. I will not defend either.

113. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 10y

The responses to what I thought were cogent and rational opinions regarding Islamic terrorism were sparse to say the least.
Two posts and ?
The banal 'Islam is a religion' doesn't exactly cut the mustard'!!!

Why don't we let 12 people voice their opinion, four of which I know have been slated for murder by moslem clerics, and they are Salman Rushdie, Irshad Manji, Taslima Nasreen and Ayaan Hirsi Ali.

Here it is folks -

After having overcome fascism, Nazism, and Stalinism, the world now faces a new totalitarian global threat: Islamism.

We, writers, journalists, intellectuals, call for resistance to religious totalitarianism and for the promotion of freedom, equal opportunity and secular values for all.

The recent events, which occurred after the publication of drawings of Muhammed in European newspapers, have revealed the necessity of the struggle for these universal values. This struggle will not be won by arms, but in the ideological field. It is not a clash of civilisations nor an antagonism of West and East that we are witnessing, but a global struggle that confronts democrats and theocrats.

Like all totalitarianisms, Islamism is nurtured by fears and frustrations. The hate preachers bet on these feelings in order to form battalions destined to impose a liberticidal and unegalitarian world. But we clearly and firmly state: nothing, not even despair, justifies the choice of obscurantism, totalitarianism and hatred. Islamism is a reactionary ideology which kills equality, freedom and secularism wherever it is present. Its success can only lead to a world of domination: man's domination of woman, the Islamists' domination of all the others. To counter this, we must assure universal rights to oppressed or discriminated people.

We reject cultural relativism, which consists in accepting that men and women of Muslim culture should be deprived of the right to equality, freedom and secular values in the name of respect for cultures and traditions. We refuse to renounce our critical spirit out of fear of being accused of "Islamophobia", an unfortunate concept which confuses criticism of Islam as a religion with stigmatization of its believers.

We plead for the universality of freedom of expression, so that a critical spirit may be exercised on all continents, against all abuses and all dogmas.

We appeal to democrats and free spirits of all countries that our century should be one of Enlightenment, not of obscurantism.

Obscurantism is opposition to extension or dissemination of knowledge beyond certain limits and to questioning dogmas.

12 signatures

Ayaan Hirsi Ali
Chahla Chafiq
Caroline Fourest
Bernard-Henri Lévy
Irshad Manji
Mehdi Mozaffari
Maryam Namazie
Taslima Nasreen
Salman Rushdie
Antoine Sfeir
Philippe Val
Ibn Warraq

But then, why listen to heretics, blasphemers and apostates.

Just kill em. Ayakilla Howmany, Tehran

114. Posted by vange (Budding Member 43 posts) 10y

Whoever said that all is fair in love and war?
What about terror for war, for the love of religion?

I recall a certain idea from a certain philosopher (which unfortunately i cannot recall exactly who) that world peace is only possible if we abolish all religions. Now that's a wishful thinking, which I think goes as well with world peace..

So how do we resolve the unfair dichotomy of Islam & Terror? I don't know..
What only comes to my mind is 'travel'-- this i need not elaborate. but if i may indulge, postering global understanding means open ideas, reaching out and experiencing them yourself..

115. Posted by applegirl (Full Member 144 posts) 10y

People like cobbana scare the living shit out of me frankly.

I'm all for freedom of speech... what about the Americans bombing al Jazeeras head quarter and killing one of their journalists??! (al Jazeera FYI is an Arabic news station)
You see in America they didn't like al Jazeeras coverage of the war.
Too much blood and suffering where shown for their taste...

I take it that you don't know any muslims personally, I do and I can assure you that most of them are just like any ordinary people.

When you compare Islam with Nazism it is as ignorant as saying that gay people are also padophiles - but who knows that's probably what you think anyway, and that's so so tragic.

116. Posted by Isadora (Travel Guru 13926 posts) 10y

Quoting applegirl

I'm all for freedom of speech... what about the Americans bombing al Jazeeras head quarter and killing one of their journalists??! (al Jazeera FYI is an Arabic news station)
You see in America they didn't like al Jazeeras coverage of the war.
Too much blood and suffering where shown for their taste...

Are you basing these statements on fact or are they just your personal opnion? If they are based on fact, then please post a link so we can all read the information. If they were taken from a media report, they are as trustworthy as any other media report, meaning biased and of little factual content.

117. Posted by applegirl (Full Member 144 posts) 10y

Isadora: http://pilger.carlton.com/print/132858 John Pilger is an Australian journalist.

One of the paragraphs reads:
If you have satellite TV, try to find the Al Jazeera channel, which has distinguished itself with its coverage. When the Americans bombed Afghanistan, one of their "smart" bombs destroyed the Al Jazeera office in Kabul. Few believe it was an accident. Rather, it was a testimony to the channel's independent journalism.

I am a member of Amnesty International and a firm believer in Human Rights. I seek my information from a lot of different sources.
I do not think the world is as easy as 'we are good, they are bad'. I am disgusted by this distorted view of muslims that among others cobbana has. I live in a city where muslims, christians, jews, buddhists etc live side by side peacefully. And beyond that are inspired by each other.

I have come to the conclusion that this travellers forum is far too bigotry for me.
I thought travellers proud themselves with knowing a little bit more about the world, that travelling built bridges between all sorts of ethinic groups, religions, backgrounds and so on.

But apperantly not here, and obviously not when it comes to Muslims.

118. Posted by mally (Respected Member 199 posts) 10y

i find it hard to agree with you. you say we should have stayed out. but that's easy to say. what about the people being torchered killed etc gassed was that o.k. no one has a magic wand and this is the real world when you died your history. they can't bring you back in the next series! The world should learn to get on with different cultures and like in the bible we have only 1 god. apparently we have free thought , but most don't use it . they go by the sheep theory. todays motto seams . distroy all it's easier than to build . todays here tommorrows another day! we all need to get a balance on life. we all only have one

119. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 10y

Quoting applegirl

Isadora: http://pilger.carlton.com/print/132858 John Pilger is an Australian journalist.

One of the paragraphs reads:
If you have satellite TV, try to find the Al Jazeera channel, which has distinguished itself with its coverage. When the Americans bombed Afghanistan, one of their "smart" bombs destroyed the Al Jazeera office in Kabul. Few believe it was an accident. Rather, it was a testimony to the channel's independent journalism.

I am a member of Amnesty International and a firm believer in Human Rights. I seek my information from a lot of different sources.
I do not think the world is as easy as 'we are good, they are bad'. I am disgusted by this distorted view of muslims that among others cobbana has. I live in a city where muslims, christians, jews, buddhists etc live side by side peacefully. And beyond that are inspired by each other.

I have come to the conclusion that this travellers forum is far too bigotry for me.
I thought travellers proud themselves with knowing a little bit more about the world, that travelling built bridges between all sorts of ethinic groups, religions, backgrounds and so on.

But apperantly not here, and obviously not when it comes to Muslims.

I'm happy to build bridges. It's just that most of the bridges to be built lead straight from the mosque to it's bookstore which sells any number of books on the evils of western culture and it's need for destruction. At least that is the case with a lot of mosques in Sydney. These bookstores are now being shut down.

120. Posted by Cupcake (Travel Guru 8468 posts) 10y

Quoting applegirl

Isadora: http://pilger.carlton.com/print/132858 John Pilger is an Australian journalist.

Well why didn't you say so!!! If it was on the internet...it must be true!!

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