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61. Posted by Q' (Travel Guru 1987 posts) 11y

Quoting Peter

Singapore's entire economy virtually is based on its capacity as a trading port. Germany, as one of the world's most important manufacturing countries, would be a huge client of theirs.

Didn't know German goods had that much pull over there. Then again, we don't get much of those types of details in Canada. Too bad some smart diplomat hasn't found a way to get more influence.

62. Posted by Q' (Travel Guru 1987 posts) 11y

Quoting SeeTheSky

i know that many would say that my philosophy is too idealistic to work. and that may be true, it may not 'work'.

If these are your beliefs, then you should do something with them. Have you ever considered going to law school, or politics or doing something to make those ideals "work" ?

63. Posted by Peter (Admin 5932 posts) 11y

This page helps back up my claims of how important the German / Singaporean relations are.

"In 2004, Germany ranked 10th in exports and 8th in imports. Total bilateral trade in 2004 stood at EUR 9.59 billion (some 2.3% up on 2003). Aggregate German investments in Singapore up to 2002 come to more than EUR 5.7 billion."

Seems reason enough for a little legal flexibility.

64. Posted by Dominatrix (Budding Member 43 posts) 11y

Quoting Q_Zhang

I don't see how it's wrong or harsh to kill an obvious drug smuggler, and it would be right to let people like him destroy other lives.

In Canada it is VERY wrong to even advocate the slaughter of human beings by an entity that purports to protect common good (i.e. the state). Of course, Canada has not had death penalty in a long time.

65. Posted by Q' (Travel Guru 1987 posts) 11y

Quoting Dominatrix

In Canada it is VERY wrong to even advocate the slaughter of human beings by an entity that purports to protect common good (i.e. the state). Of course, Canada has not had death penalty in a long time.

Not true, I don't know of ANY country in the world where that's true. There are quite a few people in every country I can think of that advocate capital punishment. It might not be politically correct to say it in certain places, but that's different.

BTW, I'm not an advocate of capital punishment. I'm an advocate of law and order so I can get $h1te done (sorry, been watching pulp fiction ) !

66. Posted by Brendan (Respected Member 1824 posts) 11y

Quoting Dominatrix

...Canada has not had death penalty in a long time

Canada had Capital Punishment in some form up until 1998.

Quoting Wikipedia

In 1967, a moratorium was placed on use of the death penalty, except for murders of police and corrections officers. In 1969, legislation was introduced to reclassify murder into capital and non-capital offences. A capital murder involved a planned or deliberate murder, murder during violent crimes, or the murder of a police officer or prison guard. Only capital murder carried the sentence of death. On 14 July 1976, bill C-84 was passed by a narrow margin in a free vote, resulting in the abolition of the death penalty, except for certain offences under the National Defence Act. In 1987, the House of Commons held another free vote, but MPs favoured maintaining abolition of the death penalty (148 to 127). In 1998, Parliament removed the death penalty for National Defence crimes.

67. Posted by Isadora (Travel Guru 13926 posts) 11y

I know I am probably going to stop the thread cold with this, but that's the chance I take in posting.... And, since the thread has evolved - going from the original topic to that of capital punishment in general - I pose the following question to anyone willing or interested in answering:

How did you come to your decision regarding capital punishment?

This is a plain and simple question. (Though I know the answers are not as plain nor as simple.) I would prefer reading answers that don't quote Wikipedia, Kofi Annon or news reports. It's a question pertaining to personal beliefs and the "whys" behind them. Everyone posting has had an opinion and I am interested in what has fueled the responses. I'll even start:

I am a pole-sitter when it comes to capital punishment and the death penalty. It is one of the reasons I have not eagerly entered this discussion. I live in a state where the death penalty is legal, though there is a moratorium at this time. (Recent DNA testing done on samples from old (closed) cases have proved some inmates innocent of their crimes and a cause for their release.) I believe there are crimes worthy of the death penalty, such as murder without remorse. If it were my family member, I would probably be willing to give the injection. I don't know. I hope I never, ever have a reason to find out. But, I also believe in living within the laws wherever I am. Whether I think they are just or not - that's another story. But, each country's government has created that particular legal system and as a citizen or non-citizen, I am still required to abide by them. I may not like the punishment, including the death penalty, but it is the reality I have to live with at this time.

I realize I am a "pole-sitter" for one very strong reason... I may believe there are certain circumstances worthy of the death penalty, but I do not want that responsibilty hanging over my head if ever called upon to be a deciding factor in someone else's fate. I will keep my finger's crossed that I will not ever have to decide...

[ Edit: Fixed text ]

68. Posted by tway (Travel Guru 7273 posts) 11y

Funny - I've been avoiding putting my two cents into this thread for much the same reason. It's not so much that I'm a pole sitter - more that I can see myself reacting in two very different ways:

1) I do not, in any way, believe in the death penalty. I cannot fathom putting someone to death to prove that it is wrong to take another's life. I think it is both hypocritical and egotistical - it is a leftover form of punishment from a time when man didn't know any better. And don't give me any of that eye-for-an-eye crap; laws are not about revenge, they are about protecting people. Indulging in the death penalty is simply barbaric - a way to justify some very base satisfaction of lording your power over another.

2) HOWEVER! If someone were to (god forbid) kill a member of my family - especially if it was a child - I'm pretty sure I'd be the first in line to pull the trigger/push the button/insert the needle. I'm pretty sure all philosophy and morality would go right out the window.

So, in the end, these cross one another out and I don't really have anything constructive to say.

69. Posted by SeeTheSky (Respected Member 558 posts) 11y

If these are your beliefs, then you should do something with them. Have you ever considered going to law school, or politics or doing something to make those ideals "work" ?

yes.. ive thought about it. and, well. it seems to make sense, when said like that, but really i could never do that. it seems hard to explain, but i just cant function in such systems or organizations. i have a hard enough time just being a human trying to find my way in society. so much of me just wants to wander and be homeless and sleep in woods and crazy shit like that. the one thing that seemed best for me in this situation was to be a writer, becuase i could openly protest what i thought was wrong, and be opinoinated in general. here and there i still have dreams of being a ghandi or MLK jr esque public speaker if i was a writer. and who knows, i might still take a shot at it. i just have to decide what i want to do... im torn over several major philosophical ideals right now and im not going to go over them cuase it would take and hour, and quite honestly, i, as everyone, still have alot to figure out.

or i could just be selfish. ah well, everyones gotta decide for themselves.

rest in peace Van Nguyen, you jeopardized your future for someone else's. might not have been a good descion, but it was yours to make, and i can only hope it had some meaning.

life is just too damn heavy sometimes.

70. Posted by Brendan (Respected Member 1824 posts) 11y

All right, I will put out my view on it. Though really I must say that STS took the words right out of my head or something.

Capital Punishment is revenge, plain and simple. It doesn't effectively deter people, it doesn't keep you safe at night. It is people making themselves feel good through the death of another.

Isa you say there should be death for someone who commits murder without remorse. Do you have a remorse-o-metre? Also there are plenty of cases of people being wrongly accused and sent to the gallows. That fact unto itself discredits the system right there, cut and dry. Capital punishment is a knee-jerk reaction to not only keep people in control, but to also appease them.

If someone close to me was killed or harmed as the result of anothers actions, I wouldn't want their death. I wouldn't allow it. I don't kill the flies at the window for the same reason. Who has judgment over life and death? No one comes to mind.

Honestly, to me ones philosophy's and moral's are not really there if they can change on whim.

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