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To smoke or not to smoke

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51. Posted by Jase007 (Travel Guru 8870 posts) 10y

I'm putting over the point that it should be up to the indivual to choose if they smoke where or the owner / workers within the premises.
It's your choice James to go into those smoke filled pubs, so no sympathy there, as for the beach, i agree, everyone should pick up their rubbish, and this is not just smokers - chewing gum, drinks, fast food etc litter the pavements, parks and every other place

The big point is if it's so bad for the health of the people and economy make it illegal, but no that won't happen as the tax take and jobs that rely on the industry will prevent this.

James point about the 24hr drinking. As with everything there is always a catch, of all the bars in England and Wales only about 200 applied for 24 hr extensions. Everyone knows that you only have a certian amount of cash to spend on drink, if you get that in 12 or 24 hrs its all you will get. And after the first year it should settle down. the stick in this one will be higher prices (see this years budget)and now ID cards are comming to a town near you !!!!

Free country? that his tonyness goes on about all the time, I don't think so - not any more. 1984 is on it's way, and they criticise other countries for not asking the country their opinion
Jase passes the rant baton before it gets too heavy

52. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 10y

jase007, I have no choice about going into smoke filled pubs when smoking is currently allowed in all pubs. Every pub in Sydney is smokey. The choice I have is to either go into a pub or not go into a pub.

I repeat my comment that if people want to smoke, then they should be free to do so in their own home, and perhaps in designated smoking areas, but no where else.

If smoking is unnacceptable in shopping centres, offices, railways, restaurants and cafes, then why is it acceptable in pubs? What makes pubs so special?

Almost every pub in Sydney is either a 24 hour place, or has extended trading hours (3am close or thereabouts). As far as the government is concerned, pubs can open as long as they like, and it's up to the residents to complain and justify why they should not be open for extended periods. I can't see a government crusade there.

53. Posted by Jase007 (Travel Guru 8870 posts) 10y

James,
there is always a choice to go into smokey pubs, there are loads of bars here in the UK that are already smoke free. Market forces (i.e. capitalism the rule of the free world so we keep being told by the goverment) or the governer/owner should dictate if a pub/shop/park/hotel/...... goes smoke free or not. And if the club is a private member club it should be up to the members to choose, not the goverment (hipocracy here as the parlament buildings bars and all prisons will be exempt from this legislation) it's not that i'm saying pubs are a special point - it's just the one everyone picks up on.
It is a known fact that most of the heavy drinkers also smoke so the till talks.
If the smoking legislation in the UK is enforced to the letter you cannot smoke in any enclosed area including your home if you work from it or a tradsman/sales etc comes to your home. smoking now, junk food, drink next, the main point is do you really want to be told how to live your life every day? People die surfing, climbing, playing golf I know it sound far fetched but the future is getting more resticted in what you can do and when and how. Health and safety has it's place, but it ought to have it's limits also.
Everyone should have the freedom to choose

54. Posted by tway (Travel Guru 7273 posts) 10y

Quoting jase007

smoking now, junk food, drink next, the main point is do you really want to be told how to live your life every day? People die surfing, climbing, playing golf I know it sound far fetched but the future is getting more resticted in what you can do and when and how. Health and safety has it's place, but it ought to have it's limits also.

I don't care if smokers choose to smoke - it's when it affects me that it gets me upset. Why should I have to reach for the puffer because someone on the street decided they wanted to smoke while walking? Yes, it's their right to smoke - but it's my right first and foremore to breathe clean air in public. Smoke is not containable or controlable - when one person smokes it's a free for all.

And I still chalk it up to personal responsibility. People who go hiking without preparation or proper equipment, for example, can cost governments tens of thousands in rescue fees. Who should pay for that? It reminds me of the big debate over cleaning up our city here: people are complaining about how much junk is on the streets, and blaming the government for not cleaning up the city better. Yet no matter where you go, you have people throwing their junk on the sidewalks and out their car windows.

If people don't take their own responsibilities seriously, I'm all for governments butting in to do it for them.

Steps off soap box and settles back into being 5'3"...

55. Posted by Jase007 (Travel Guru 8870 posts) 10y

jase jumps up on soap box for another freedom rant
Fair point that you have the right to breathe fresh air, I'll give you that one on the bases that there should also be a ban on 1-all motor vehicles (pollute like crazy), heavy industry, cement industry, farming of animals (methane gas a major cause of greenhouse gasses) also.
I doubt Smoking in the street causes more pollution than the above mentioned items. We live in a polluted world, one that is getting worse with the narrow minded approach of certian goverments (USA) and increased demand for energy and luxury items in developing countries (china, india....)

As for Smoke is not containable or controlable - when one person smokes it's a free for all. make the non smokers pay for it (and i don't smoke by the way).

Jase steps down from the box to make a cup of coffee and try and do some work

56. Posted by tway (Travel Guru 7273 posts) 10y

Those are equally valid, but altogether different issues. I don't think we can argue the right to smoke in public by comparing it to vehicle pollution, and so forth. One can't choose to drive only in one's home, for example, or build a "car-only" section of a city that's enclosed to protect pollutants from escaping. I see your point, but it feels too much like comparing apples and oranges.

Notices soapbox is getting a bit scuffed so gives it a scrub.

57. Posted by walkabout (Budding Member 39 posts) 10y

It certainly is strange to be overseas in a country where it seems like the majority of people smoke and smoking in lots of restaurants/cafes is the norm. I am not a fan of it (being an asthmatic and a non-smoker), but it will be strange to head back to Oz later this year (i think the no-smoking in pubs comes into effect around this time?). Anyway, not to ramble but i guess i find it odd that sometimes you can adjust yourselves to things whilst travelling (even things you don`t like!) and then u have to re-adjust when heading home...

Smoking doesn`t bother me as much in the wintertime strangely, but when u are sitting inside on a warm Spring day (ie. if there is no seating outside), it is especially horrible having smoke blown in ur face

but yes, am glad oz will be more cigarette smoke- Free !
:)

58. Posted by walkabout (Budding Member 39 posts) 10y

Quoting jase007

People die surfing, climbing, playing golf I know it sound far fetched but the future is getting more resticted in what you can do and when and how. Health and safety has it's place, but it ought to have it's limits also. Everyone should have the freedom to choose

whoops forgot...
yes - i choose not to have smoke blown in my face and to get sick from it. Plus, those surfers and climbers and golfers.... ??

59. Posted by Jase007 (Travel Guru 8870 posts) 10y

Quoting walkabout

whoops forgot...
yes - i choose not to have smoke blown in my face and to get sick from it. Plus, those surfers and climbers and golfers.... ??

Good on you,
The more people who choose that option the better - but as a choice

60. Posted by Cupcake (Travel Guru 8468 posts) 10y

Quoting tway

Steps off soap box and settles back into being 5'3"...

psssssst T......you amazon you.. ;)