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Anyone else bothered by the current little war??

Travel Forums General Talk Anyone else bothered by the current little war??

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21. Posted by aliyoung99 (Budding Member 56 posts) 10y

what you say is true...However, Reports in the Guardian (respected UK paper) mentioned that the Americans have authorised the israeli's strike against the lebanon in order to crush hezbollah's military infrastructure. Its just a shame that the west (and to some extent Israel) have not learned that this radical form of islam that we face, has been stoked by the wars we wage in Iraq and Afghanistan. This Islamic militants feel that have nothing to lose - The israeli state is used by the Americans to assist its foreign policy in the middle East and it wouldnt surprise me if Syria and Iran become involved in the near future. All sides must come together and discuss this... And if Lebanon are in breach of Resolution 1559 (the one calling on Syria to leave and the disarmament of Hezbollah) then the international community must act. At the minute world politics is so divided that i wouldnt be surprised if unilateral action by the US would be only way to stop this escalating (and would Bush risk the wrath of the Jewish Defense League by sending troops in?) i think not.

22. Posted by Jase007 (Travel Guru 8870 posts) 10y

Overkill is what it is.
I just think someone has to watch out that the seed they sew isn't going to come back and bite their ass.

23. Posted by Belize Me (Full Member 137 posts) 10y

Quoting aliyoung99

... And if Lebanon are in breach of Resolution 1559 (the one calling on Syria to leave and the disarmament of Hezbollah) then the international community must act. At the minute world politics is so divided that i wouldnt be surprised if unilateral action by the US would be only way to stop this escalating (and would Bush risk the wrath of the Jewish Defense League by sending troops in?) i think not.

You make some good points, but I have some questions.

Firstly, which countries would you include in the 'ínternational community' that you speak of?

Secondly, what do you think they (the international community) should do when you say they "must act"? Do you have any suggestions?

Loads of people want 'the international community' to 'do something', but they never say what they want them to do.

Personally, I don't think any amount of negotiation or embargos will end the fighting at this point because I don't think radical islam will be happy until they have conquered the world and that will never happen.

Thirdly, why would you want George Bush send American troops in if, as you say "Its just a shame that the west (and to some extent Israel) have not learned that this radical form of islam that we face, has been stoked by the wars we wage in Iraq and Afghanistan."?

If GB sent in the troops would that not be stoking the fire and pissing off radical islam even more?

As a westerner (sheesh I almost apologized for this thought by prefacing this sentence with 'Sorry but,'...changed my mind... no, I'm not sorry, I mean it), I'm getting mighty annoyed at being blamed for making the terrorists act as they do. Obviously they LOVE the western way of life or they wouldn't be trying so damn hard to take us over.

24. Posted by aliyoung99 (Budding Member 56 posts) 10y

The international community i speak of is the UN.

But then as i think more about it, the UN failed to act decisively in Iraq...NATO cannot be called on for more troops and i dont think the Europeans are willing, or able to get involved. Why not the Arab League??? They are so annoyed with the constant Western involvement in their way of life.. why not ask them to commit peacekeepers into south Lebanon?? I dont condone what Israel is doing and i certainly dont feel Hezbollah are justified in indiscriminate attacks on the jewish population but We need something to happen or we (UK and US) are going to get dragged in and thousands will die.. We need to back the lebanese Government and provide them with the means of disarming hezbollah.. be it through the UN or not... the West and Islamic nations need to start working together and solving some of these deep seated problems.

I dont think Islamic Fundamentalists want to take over the West... i guess they are p1ssed off that we, seem to want to embark on a new wave of colonisation (Afghanistan) and with the puppet government in Iraq, the US has a foothold and a staging post for an attack on Iran and Syria... Turn it around.. How would we feel?

25. Posted by magykal1 (Travel Guru 2026 posts) 10y

Problem is that both sides (Israel and Hezbollah) seem to offer little regret for the loss of civilian life on either side - both are sitting in the sort of democracies we like to promote. The only thing we can do is put pressure in every possible way on both Israel and Hezbollah (and their funders/supporters) to avoid wasting civilian lives through sanctions on both and the threat of an imposed UN peace force - it appears that our governments don't have the will to do this.

26. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 10y

Hezbollah is the terrorist wing of the Iranian theocratic dictatorship, and Syria aids them in their quest to destroy the state of Israel.
The question of whether Israel should have been created back in 1948 is an interesting intellectual exercise, but Israel exists, and it's destruction, with the implied genocide of it's citizens, has been a central plank of Hamas, the ayatollahs and Islamists for many years.
Hezbollah would never have killed 8 Israeli troops and kidnapped 2 others without a nod and wink from Tehran, and the expected reaction from Israel has been of great benefit.
It takes the spotlight off Iran's pursuit of nuclear weapons and Syria's very suspected implication in the assassination of former Lebanese PM Rafik Hariri.
It inflames the moslem world, encourages hatred of the West (America in particular) and makes Hezbollah look like modern day heroes for attacking the Zionist entity (their words, not mine).
If, not when, this particular action sputters to a halt, the Lebanese government should -

1) Total the human cost (dead, injured, traumatised, displaced)
2) Total the property destruction (airports, ports, bridges, roads, houses, crops, orchards, etc)

Divide both bills by 3.

Send the 1/3rd bill to Assad II in Damascus

Send the 2/3rd bill to Khamenei in Tehran.

The Australian government has given a conservative estimate cost of $25 million Aussie dollars to evacuate our citizens from Lebanon.
I hope they call in the Iranian ambassador and hand him the bill with 90 days to pay before legal action will be taken.

27. Posted by t_maia (Travel Guru 3289 posts) 10y

But, one of the largest lobbying groups in Washington is the Jewish Defense League. As much as I may dislike the man and his politics, I don't think he's looking forward to a knock on the door by the JDL.

Thank God for small mercies. I wish I could make every single member of that damn JDL read "From Beirut to Jerusalem" by Thomas L. Friedman!

...However, Reports in the Guardian (respected UK paper) mentioned that the Americans have authorised the israeli's strike against the lebanon in order to crush hezbollah's military infrastructure. Its just a shame that the west (and to some extent Israel) have not learned that this radical form of islam that we face, has been stoked by the wars we wage in Iraq and Afghanistan. This Islamic militants feel that have nothing to lose -

Interesting statement. Though I strongly disagree that this "radical form of islam .. has been stoked by the wars we wage". True, it is a factor, but the underlying reasons have more to do with the economic and social problems brought on by mismanagement through the governments in the whole ME over centuries.

People are looking for answers for the economic decline and the easiest and most widely understood one is that "Life is bad because we have fallen from faith, so we must return to our roots." In this case this means preaching radical Islam as the solution to all problems. The Muslim Brother's, known in Egypt as a terrorist organisation, are basically a grassroots social movement that has taken it unto themselves to organise basic nessecities the government failed to provide. Schools for children, food and shelter for the homeless, care of the elderly, etc all out of a deep religious motivation. They saw a need, and they filled in.

The problem with this is that they are taking over functions that are normally associated with the government. This ursurping of government duties and their preaching the their form of Islam (ie how the state should really be run) threatens the government. As the Muslim Brothers are an international organisation, their very existence threatens governments all over the ME. Hamas and Hezbollah are similar, rivaling organisations.

So we have three major groups of players - first the corrupt, ineffective governments in the ME, second the religious groups rivalling each other while angling for social reforms and ultimatively governmental power and third the countries with interests in the region like the USA or even direct neighboring countries, supporting who ever suits them and generally messing things up. Everybody fights with everybody and alliances can be formed and broken over night (The enemy of my enemy is my friend now and my enemy tomorrow.)

No solution is in sight, but a radical change in US politics could help tremendously IMO.

Just my 0.2 cents.

[ Edit: Edited at Jul 23, 2006 8:58 AM by t_maia ]

28. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 10y

There are some criminals living in my street, so the police blockaded the road, ransacked every house, beat up anyone they could find, destroyed all the cars parked on the street, and then called it "a targeted response".

No wonder people dislike the cops.

29. Posted by Jase007 (Travel Guru 8870 posts) 10y

Quoting james

There are some criminals living in my street, so the police blockaded the road, ransacked every house, beat up anyone they could find, destroyed all the cars parked on the street, and then called it "a targeted response".

No wonder people dislike the cops.

are you sure you don't live in Victoria

30. Posted by mikeyBoab (Travel Guru 5077 posts) 10y

Condoleeza has made it clear that the US will not stop Israel, at least not yet. The USA want Syria to stop supporting Hezbollah so as to isolate Iran. Should Syria become neutral, I think it'll be interesting to see what happens next . . .

By the way, we've not been hearing much about North Korea of late, have we?