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e.u. citizenship

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1. Posted by tzindaro (Budding Member 11 posts) 9y

I am an American citizen and want to get European Union citizenship. I do not want just residence; I want an E.U. passport. The only way I can do that without a long delay seems to be by getting married to someone from some European country who wants a crack at living in the USA in exchange. Most E.U. countries seem to have a delay of at least a few years. Does anyone know of any E.U. country where I could get citizenship by marriage immediately, without a long delay? Which countries are the fastest? Also, which countries have the easiest and simplest procedures for this? Thank you.

2. Posted by bentivogli (Travel Guru 2398 posts) 9y

You should ask t_maia, she's the expert. But don't get your hopes up; in all countries that I know about, citizenship is only granted after 3-5 years of marriage, during which your partner must be able to provide sufficient financial support for the both of you.

Also, the way your question is phrased makes me very curious if not suspicious as to your motives. Would you care to explain why you're so desperate to obtain European citizenship?

cheers, Niels

3. Posted by tzindaro (Budding Member 11 posts) 9y

Thank you for the information. To answer your question: in the last few years America has become for all intents and purposes, a theocratic police state. The resemblence to the process in Germany in the 1930s is striking. I simply do not want to live in a dictatorship. Europe is a secular civilization with so far, still at least some regard for human rights and due process. All the Europeans I have met are far more in keeping with my attitudes and values than the American public, which is now going through the phase Germany went through in the 30s, with Christianity as the local form of Nazism. Beyond that, your question is itself an indication of how far we still have to go before the universal human right to live wherever one wishes is universally accepted. I should not have to justify my choice of where to travel or reside on my own planet to anyone. Not to some nosey official, and not to someone on a forum like this. The sooner the strange notion that people are property and must live where someone else allows them to is gotten rid of, the better. There are several websites promoting World Citizenship. Check them out and learn that anyone should be free to choose where to live.

4. Posted by GregW (Travel Guru 2635 posts) 9y

Quoting tzindaro

Beyond that, your question is itself an indication of how far we still have to go before the universal human right to live wherever one wishes is universally accepted. I should not have to justify my choice of where to travel or reside on my own planet to anyone. Not to some nosey official, and not to someone on a forum like this.

Given the amount of money that governments spend to support their populations in the form of infrastructure, security and social services, I hardly think that one should have the right to move or live anywhere and expect that support without having some responsibility to the people of that state.

I accept your desire to move somewhere, but question your desire to just get citizenship without moving to or residing in Europe. Why should you expect that the citizens of any European country should just accept you as one of the them if you are unwilling to put in any time residing in the country and proving yourself as a productive member of their society?

Greg

5. Posted by tzindaro (Budding Member 11 posts) 9y

If someone is in a country and working, they are paying taxes and contributing just as much as someone who was born there. So the question of costs of social services is a red herring. Also, the issue of basic unfairness exists, that one American or Australian, who is luckey enough to have had a grandparent born in say, Ireland or Italy, over a century ago, perhaps, can therefore live and work in Spain or Germany, while another Australian or American, who was not so luckey in his ancestry, cannot. This is nothing but blatant discrimination, and no more acceptable than discrimination on grounds of skin color. People should always be delt with on a basis of individuals, not as members of some group that they had no choice about joining. If you take a look, you will find that it is al├▒ways the right-wing neo-nazi racists in any country who are screaming about the immigrants costing money and commiting crimes. The motivation is racism, pure and simple. As a matter of fact, no country in Europe is really worried about millions of uneducated Americans moving in and taking unskilled jobs. The immigration laws are passed with Moslems and Asians in mind, and them applied to the stray American or Australian to avoid the appearence of racism. Besides, who ever said I did not plan to live in Europe? I do intend to live there. I just said I want to get citizenship as soon as possible, without a long residence period being required first.

6. Posted by GregW (Travel Guru 2635 posts) 9y

Aaah! I misunderstood your question. I thought you wanted just a passport without moving to Europe. My mistake.

So, I take it that you don't have European ancestry?

7. Posted by bentivogli (Travel Guru 2398 posts) 9y

It seems to me that you're contradicting yourself. If you're so much in favour of world citizenship, why would you be so interested in changing nationalities and not just settle for residency? After all, being American or European in your book would all be the same, wouldn't it?

8. Posted by Purdy (Travel Guru 3546 posts) 9y

Just a word of warning here folks - keep this friendly and above board - there is nothing wrong with a bit of healthy debate and this is an interesting thread but if ANY posts get in any way antagonistic or l feel encroach on the form rules l will have no qualms about deleting the post!

Thanks

Heather

9. Posted by t_maia (Travel Guru 3289 posts) 9y

The immigration laws are passed with Moslems and Asians in mind, and them applied to the stray American or Australian to avoid the appearence of racism.

That is rubbish if you ask me. Even if such a racial purpose was there, it would not be able to get into the law. The German law text regarding foreigner reads "foreigner", not "Asian" or "Black". It is totally objective. Racism is sujective and man-made. The officer might be stricter when it comes to proving sufficient funds for an immigrant from Africa, but they can play just as hardball against an EU-citizen who doesn't play by the rules laid down in the law book.

Besides, who ever said I did not plan to live in Europe? I do intend to live there. I just said I want to get citizenship as soon as possible, without a long residence period being required first.

There is a reason why Germany and other countries do not hand out citizenships by the bucket load. Being a citizen of a country gives you certain rights and duties. If you are born to it, you will be granted these rights automatically. If not, you have to earn them.

You have to prove your desire to be German by your style of life. This involves living in Germany, speaking the language, knowing your way around a newspaper and having some basic knowledge of key political issues.

You write nothing about whether you have ever been to Europe before.

For years, it was my dream to go to the USA and live there. It did not feel very German at all, but rather like a "Weltenb├╝rger", a world citizen. To me, the whole was my home. My stay in the USA changed that radically. I had never been away from Germany for a longer period of time before, nor been without people I knew. It was from being in the USA that I began to appreciate the fact that I was a German citizen, that German was my native languge, etc. I decided then that life in the USA was not for me, that I would never be able to live in the USA and call it home too.

My dream died when it faced the reality of life in the US.

What about your dream?

I find it very sensible to have a waiting period for foreigners applying for German citizenship. After all if you want, you can go and live in the EU tomorrow. (Feel free to contact me about the procedure for Germany.)

10. Posted by tzindaro (Budding Member 11 posts) 9y

Quoting GregW

Aaah! I misunderstood your question. I thought you wanted just a passport without moving to Europe. My mistake.

So, I take it that you don't have European ancestry?

As far as I know, all my ancestry is from Europe, but I am not eligible for citizenship on ancestry grounds.