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171. Posted by wouterrr (Travel Guru 3379 posts) 9y

Quoting james

Well, for a start there are religous scholars ("weird human beings")walking around who "dont want women to do anything and take them as their possession ....".

This came from fuchinsrot who is "living here ... i should know better than you ..."

My friend. I think she meant to say that these are the extremists. The people that do wrong an abuse the religion for power. And they get the news and you, sorry to say it, seem a little short sighted to believe that this is where islam is all about. In other words. From its roots Islam is an evil religion?

172. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 9y

Quoting Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ

I think James has almost drown in the sea of media. His vision of the islam is the vision of the Islamic extremist. That is no good, James:(

I knew it wouldn't take long for the old "media" topic to come up.

The media and issues of media bias seem to be a pretty common thing with muslims. It's as though only muslims know the "real truth". They seem to have access to some secret media outlets that non-muslims don't know about

173. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 9y

Quoting Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ

Quoting james

Well, for a start there are religous scholars ("weird human beings")walking around who "dont want women to do anything and take them as their possession ....".

This came from fuchinsrot who is "living here ... i should know better than you ..."

My friend. I think she meant to say that these are the extremists. The people that do wrong an abuse the religion for power. And they get the news and you, sorry to say it, seem a little short sighted to believe that this is where islam is all about. In other words. From its roots Islam is an evil religion?

I don't know whether the roots of Islam are evil or not, and I don't care. But there's a hell of a lot of people doing a hell of a lot of things in the name of Islam that one could call acts of evil, wouldn't you say?

Do you know the saying, "if it walks like a duck, then it probably is a duck" ?

174. Posted by wouterrr (Travel Guru 3379 posts) 9y

Quoting james

Quoting Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ

I think James has almost drown in the sea of media. His vision of the islam is the vision of the Islamic extremist. That is no good, James:(

I knew it wouldn't take long for the old "media" topic to come up.

The media and issues of media bias seem to be a pretty common thing with muslims. It's as though only muslims know the "real truth". They seem to have access to some secret media outlets that non-muslims don't know about

That media topic has been thrown to my head as well. So I joined the very same club. I am not a muslim, I have Christian faith. I said that about the 80 million fundamental Christians in North-America where this thread is originally is about. What exactly is the real truth from your point of view. I asked before, tell me exactly why its even worse then you thought. back that up with an argument because its loose. How can I react on a loose statement. Arguments....

[ Edit: Edited on Feb 8, 2007, at 1:40 AM by Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ ]

175. Posted by wouterrr (Travel Guru 3379 posts) 9y

.

[ Edit: Edited on Feb 8, 2007, at 1:39 AM by Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ ]

176. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru 4567 posts) 9y

Quoting Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ

Because what the hell are we doing here if there is nothing....

Nothing?
The fact, that we are here, means that there is something. We are something. Why would religious rituals make us more valid?

177. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru 4567 posts) 9y

Quoting Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ

Quoting Mel.

And the majority of people in the world believe that men are better than women. I dont go with the majority means proof, in this case, either.

That has to do with religion. Because the book says that women are lower then men. people that still think like that are unflexible in interpretation.

If religion has to be so flexible, doent that mean it lacks in substance?
Maybe religion should permanently become a part of history, instead of being integrated into the culture of every country. It could be replaced, by state laws and common sense. Why have 2 sets of rules.

178. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru 4567 posts) 9y

Quoting Wﺭﺍﺪﻤﺎﮐﺭ

Quoting Herr Bert

Because what the hell are we doing here if there is nothing....

What would be the problem, for you if there is no God?

There would not necesarily be a problem. But what is the use of living 80 years and then die and then nothing and darkness? This very much off the topic and beyond my brains. So I am not going to discuss this. Sorry, herr bert!:)

This is an interesting thought. I think it explains why religion takes such a hold, on people, even though there is no scientific proof, for many of the beliefs.

Fear attaches people to religion and keeps them there. They fear, not existing. As far back as they remember, they have existed. They know, they did not exist, before they were conceived, and that they never had any problems back then. But still they fear going back, to this non existance. They fear so much, that they make up an after life, reincarnation etc
Going to heaven or comming back here is consoling, for them.

This though came to me, when I was pregnant, and wondering if I should have an epidural, during the birth. The thought of not being able to feel my entire lower body, was creepy. It will be there, but I wont be aware of it, in the usual way. I think this fear is similiar to fear of non existance. I wonder how many women would rather be in pain, than overcome the fear of not feeling anything, at all.

179. Posted by Herr Bert (Moderator 1384 posts) 9y

Quoting dr.pepper

Quoting fuchsinrot

im reading how different religions are similar .... "but i dont agree with you"
what dont we agree upon?
i want to know where the differences lie ...

can anyone tell me 5 differences between islam and christianity, except the fact that our pray methods are different and we hold some different imagery or not in front of us when bowing ... ?

Christianity claims that Jesus was the son of God and that through him and him alone can man find his/her way to heaven. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the distinct impression that Muslims would not agree that.

I will gladly take up the challenge...

To understand the claim of Christiany that Jesus is the son of God, you should know your history better. The term son of God, was really a very common term 2000-2500 years ago, any one who was a believer, and made a little more effort for it, would be called a son of good. (translated to the present: every believer, who shows up in Church, would be called a son of god.). You can imagine, that there were not a 100 people being called son of god, but thousands. It was only later (well much later) that Jesus was being declared the One and only son of God. The person who made this decision was the Roman Emperor Constantine in 312 !!! This was also the time, that the Roman-Christian Church as we know it today, was founded by the Romans, and this church wouldn't dare to contradict a decree made by the Emperor himself.

P.S. I am not a scientist, I only read a lot, and not science made me an athiest, but I have to give that credit to Philosophy.

180. Posted by Herr Bert (Moderator 1384 posts) 9y

Quoting james

But the men who oppress the women; these guys are pretty strict moslems right? Live their lives according the Koran? Do what's right to please Allah?

They might be strict Muslims, in the way they interpretate the Koran, but a lot of the other groups, who interpretate the Koran in another way, will tell them they are not.

I think the biggest mistake we westeners make, when we are talking about Islam, is that we believe that there is only 1 kind of Islam, but in fact there are numerous kinds. Ranging from the very liberal Alevis in Turkey, till very extreme groups of Sunni. (with Liberal and extreme, I want to classify the way they incorperate faith in every day life, not the teachings themselves).

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