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same sex relationships ??????

Travel Forums Off Topic same sex relationships ??????

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11. Posted by tway (Travel Guru, 7274 posts) 17 May '07 06:01

Quoting Mel.

Quoting garry moll

Or is the same sex relationship confusing children and misleading them to thing this relationship is the norm ?
just venting my thoughts.

The norm?
The norm is whatever a lot of people do.

I agree with Mel here. "Norm" is pretty meaningless - it's just what the majority of people have/do/think/etc. With that reasoning, it's "abnormal" to have blue eyes, be left-handed, speak Dutch, have red hair, listen to ABBA, and so on.

I still say we should worry about children who are being mistreated - not those who are being raised in a loving relationship of any kind. Many grandparents raise their grandkids - is that abnormal? The age gap is huge, but if they love those kids and want their best, isn't that better than keeping them with abusive parents?

Kids need to learn love and tolerance, from whoever is raising them.

12. Posted by Fun Bobby (Budding Member, 115 posts) 17 May '07 06:08

Listening to Abba IS abnormal!!

13. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru, 4567 posts) 17 May '07 06:43

Single mothers were not the "norm", until how long ago? 20 years? And maybe 100 years before that the children of single mothers were branded as bastards, and the laws of most countries were prejudiced against them.
How many people know, that Henry VIII actually did have a son. But this son did not count, at the time, because he was a bastard. And if he was a bastard, in those days, his mother would have been a whore. Having a baby out of wedlock, even if it was the kings baby was not the norm.
I am very glad that it is the norm, to be an unmarried mother and subject to no prejudice by law, or by people in general, because I am an unmarried mother.
What exactly is wrong with gay couples bringing up children, anyway? Why is it such a long struggle, for groups to gain acceptance in society, when they are doing no harm, to others in society? They are not the norm is way too light weight an argument.;)

[ Edit: Edited on May 17, 2007, at 6:43 AM by Mel. ]

14. Posted by yolandac8 (Respected Member, 159 posts) 17 May '07 09:39

Quoting tway

And since sexual orientation has everything to do with being a full human being, and nothing to do with hurting anyone, to me it's a moot point to argue.

As for bringing children into a gay relationship, I'd be more worried about unfit parents - straight or gay - who are doing a terrible job of raising children.

I do SO MUCH agree with you (i guess it's not the proper construction in English, but it's so true!!!). I see terrible parents everyday... The other day I was in the tube, and I could see a young boy (no older than 7) fitting against her mother, punching her!!!!! What was that about???? I couldn't understand anything. What does it matter gay, lesbian or straight if the PERSON is nice, good, honest and well educated?

We often forget about each person, the people, when wanting to globalize about a condition or something. It is so unfair...

Yolanda

15. Posted by Q' (Moderator, 1987 posts) 17 May '07 11:04

Quoting tway

Quoting Mel.

Quoting garry moll

Or is the same sex relationship confusing children and misleading them to thing this relationship is the norm ?
just venting my thoughts.

The norm?
The norm is whatever a lot of people do.

I agree with Mel here. "Norm" is pretty meaningless - it's just what the majority of people have/do/think/etc. With that reasoning, it's "abnormal" to have blue eyes, be left-handed, speak Dutch, have red hair, listen to ABBA, and so on.

Sorry, I have to disagree with the comments about the "norm" being meaningless. Unless the child is kept only at home and away from the rest of society, the "norm", unfortunate I know, DOES matter.

I'm not disagreeing with gays raising children or gay relationships. But I don't think it's that easy to ignore the opinions of the rest of society. At least not for now, until attitudes change. I find the whole attitude of some gay parents to ignore this fact to be slightly selfish and hurtful to the child in the long run. Parenthood does not "legitimize" gay relationships in my mind. Being in a gay relationship and gay parenthood should be kept separate.

16. Posted by flo jo (Respected Member, 414 posts) 17 May '07 11:26

I do beleive everyone can do what they feel like doing as long as they dont hurt others.
Are we really sure the kids who grow up with gay parents are not hurt.
Having gay parents it´s being different to other kid.
Being different when you are at school is a nightmare.
Kids are horrible to eachothers. If you are over or under weight, if you wear glasses, if you wear dental equipment you will be the target in the recreational area so imagine if your parents are gays.

17. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru, 4567 posts) 17 May '07 11:50

Quoting Q'

Quoting tway

Quoting Mel.

Quoting garry moll

Or is the same sex relationship confusing children and misleading them to thing this relationship is the norm ?
just venting my thoughts.

The norm?
The norm is whatever a lot of people do.

I agree with Mel here. "Norm" is pretty meaningless - it's just what the majority of people have/do/think/etc. With that reasoning, it's "abnormal" to have blue eyes, be left-handed, speak Dutch, have red hair, listen to ABBA, and so on.

Sorry, I have to disagree with the comments about the "norm" being meaningless. Unless the child is kept only at home and away from the rest of society, the "norm", unfortunate I know, DOES matter.

I'm not disagreeing with gays raising children or gay relationships. But I don't think it's that easy to ignore the opinions of the rest of society. At least not for now, until attitudes change. I find the whole attitude of some gay parents to ignore this fact to be slightly selfish and hurtful to the child in the long run. Parenthood does not "legitimize" gay relationships in my mind. Being in a gay relationship and gay parenthood should be kept separate.

I dont think attitudes will change, until the norm changes, and the norm wont change, until people start doing things that are not the norm, and thus making them the norm.

I dont think being slaves to the conservative and/or narrowminded should be a condition of how entitled people are to become parents.

Anyway, whether the norm is meaningless or not, it is certainly transient. What is the norm in society today will not be the norm, when the babies being born today reach adulthood.

18. Posted by Utrecht (Moderator, 5537 posts) 17 May '07 12:54

Quoting Fun Bobby

Listening to Abba IS abnormal!!

LOL, only if you are listening to Dancing Queer...uhm, Queen

19. Posted by Utrecht (Moderator, 5537 posts) 17 May '07 12:57

....but to stay on topic...
Don't have any problems with gay relationships at all, whether it being between two guys or two girls.
And about having kids: well, probably two same sex persons understand eachother much better than a heterosexual couple, meaning less arguments, fights etc. Might even be better for the children, seeing a relationship which is great! Instead of all those couples getting divorced for very unexplainable reasons actually.

20. Posted by Q' (Moderator, 1987 posts) 17 May '07 13:44

Quoting Utrecht

And about having kids: well, probably two same sex persons understand eachother much better than a heterosexual couple, meaning less arguments, fights etc.

The counter arguement to that is that two sexes balance each other out. There's also a lot of psychological research related to child growth and the affects of absentee mothers and absentee fathers. How much of that is environment related and "norm" related I don't know and I doubt anyone knows for sure at this stage. The jury is still out on this one I think. I'm not a childhood psychiatrist so can't say more than that.

In the end, I think it's about whether the parents take responsibility for the child, and knowing and being realistic about what you're getting yourself into. I think gay parents, or single parents can be great parents. And the skills involved are the same as those for heterosexual parents. BUT, it will be a DIFFERENT life.

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