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The War in Iraq

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31. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru 4567 posts) 9y

Quoting wotthefiqh

Quoting mikeyBoab

Well, the US House of Representatives have voted for a withdrawal of troops by April 2008, yet Bush is standing firm, suggesting that this is merely a reaction to opinion polls.

What should be done?

What should have been done?

The usual reasons for the invasion of Iraq -

Oil.
Oil is the most important source of energy and industrial derivatives, but it is not solely found in the moslem world (Saudi/Iraq/Iran).
If the US wanted to secure oil supplies, there are other far less violent countries to get it from.
Instead of antagonising over 1 billion moslems, the CIA could have overthrown Chavez in Venezuela (scarcely a precedent) or simply bribed a few hundred top officials of Nigeria.
That oft-quoted reason doesn't stack up.

The goddamned Sad-of-a-bitch tried to kill ma daddie.

Why wait all these years to do it and waste billions of dollars and thousands of American lives?
Even Bush isn't that Waco!!!

Crusaders/Zionists want to destroy Islam.
Khomeini spouted that crap and disagreeing with ayatallohs gets you killed.

We should have finished the job in Afghanistan and left Sadie killing his own people in peace.

Aragorn, get out of there

Then why did the war happen, in your opinion?
Was it just somebody saying, which country will we play war games in now? Close your eyes, spin 10 times and then put a pin on the map.

32. Posted by daveh (Travel Guru 1027 posts) 9y

Actually Mel, you are nearly right. The defence industry generates a huge amount of money, but to ensure the huge amounts of cash are being generated, then you need to convince a nation that there is a threat to your security from somewhere. Since the end of the cold war that is what they have been looking for and i bet after 9/11 there were a few people in the defence industry quietly opening a bottle of bubbly.

I don't know much about US politicians, but i bet if you look at those championing the war in Iraq, a large percentage of them will be board members of big defence companies.

I look forward to a few years, when our PM Gordon Brown (who is Scottish for those who don't know) persecutes the majority English and a fully trained and mobilised Iraqi army come and occupy the UK in an effort to abolish his impending tyranny

33. Posted by Mel. (Travel Guru 4567 posts) 9y

Thanks Deveh, for the explanation:)

What cold and evil monsters those war mongering toads are.

Mel

34. Posted by Brendan (Respected Member 1824 posts) 9y

wotthefiqh,

The CIA did try to get Chavez out.

35. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 9y

The Iraqis are killing each other. It's muslim vs muslim (funny how we are told this is the religion of peace every time a terrorist is caught). Mosque's being blown to pieces, car bombs killing scores of their own countrymen on a daily basis.

Seems to me they're are doing a sterling job of turning their country into a living hell without requiring the help of the Americans and others.

You can't blame the Americans for this. Simply saying that the Americans "set it off" or something similar is not good enough. so you think it would have been some sort of Utopia without the US invasion?

I say get out now, save the US taxpayer their money, save the US (and others) soldiers their own lives, and forget about it.

There's no threat from other countries because they didn't "finish the job" simply because no country would want the job started in their own backyard in the first place, whether it was finished or not.

36. Posted by daveh (Travel Guru 1027 posts) 9y

Interesting words coming from the Iraqi PM. If Bush has any sense then he will see this as a way out.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/07/14/iraq.military.ap/index.html

37. Posted by SeeTheSky (Respected Member 558 posts) 9y

there's nothing practical that can be done.
maybe write a few letters to senators, and wait for a new election, but let's face it, the Governing process is so far from the reach of american hands that we are honestly helpless to the descions of fatrichwhiteopinionated men

at this point, just hope we don't implode.
or maybe, hope we do.

=)
Evan

38. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 9y

Quoting Brendan

wotthefiqh,

The CIA did try to get Chavez out.

The Jimmy Carter way, by prayer and sweet smiles.
What's wrong with the tried and trusted ways.
Poisoned cigar or strafing the presidential palace ala Salvadore Allende.
Perhaps the Syrian car bomb methode, or the al-Qaeda explosive video camera ala the Lion of the Panjshir, or the Soviet spetnaz assassinating Afghani communist leader Hafizullah Amin.

39. Posted by Herr Bert (Moderator 1384 posts) 9y

I'm curious what everyone thinks will happen between the Shiites and Sunnis and Kurds once US troops really do pull out. Our nightly news coverage shows mostly car bombs killing innocent Iraqis. Will they suddenly stop killing each other because we're not there? I imagine it will be an even larger bloodbath when the troops leave, and the country will split into 3 territories.

One thing about Saddam.......he knew how to keep his countrymen from killing each other en masse. Not too dissimilar from Marshall Tito, Joey Stalin, Chairman Mao, among others. Nothing like fear of a dictator and his secret police to keep you in line.

Of course this was a fool's errand. It's revenge for Daddy in '91 as well as convincing America that it won't hurt a bit paying USD$3.50 for a gallon of Iraqi SUV Juice. Conveniently in this brilliant plan to take over the world, President Pinky has a promise from VP Brain that all their friends in the oil business will be able to provide college educations for their spawn until the end of time. Oh, and drive ever larger limousines powered the aforementioned SUV Juice.

Everybody calls Bush an idiot. OK, no stretch there, but consider how difficult it is to get on camera with that obnoxious little smirk and tell people "either yer with us, or against us". It brings a little tear to my eye *sniff* when I see so many of my fellow Americans marching lockstep with statements like that. It gives me hope that, one day, I too may be able to take over the world

Most likely in the end Iraq will be split into 3 countries, that is by far the most sensible option. This way at least 2/3 of the country will be relative safe places for the people that live there. But before that will happen a lot of blood will be shed. The sunni part of Iraq will become a problem, just like Taliban Afghanistan was.

What I don't like is that every day you hear a number of people that are killed, and like Utrecht says it's just a number (almost like bingo: 34 - 32 - 55 - 9), what people don't get anymore is that every death means a tragedy in a family. Each person killed in Iraq in this war (soldier or not), is somebody's husband, wife, brother, sister, father or mother. Just for one second imagine it's your own familymember, and multiply the pain you would feel by a factor of .... (sorry but no one seems to count anymore). At this moment the US army is doing more harm than good. So get the ^#*#-out of there.

Looking back I believe that if you wanted to get rid of Saddam, the coalition in 1991 should have pushed onwards to Baghdad, in that time, you would have had far less problems to overthrown Saddam, and get the Shiites/Kurds in power of Iraq. But no, the coalistion left the Shiites and the Kurds to battle alone and getting defeated and wiped out in the end.

And yes Beerman, almost everybody believes Bush is an idiot, but it's a democratic chosen idiot. (well once for sure). I hope that after Bush has left, there will be a decent investigation on the why's and how's in this war. But the retoric used by bush after 9/11 and the ease by which almost all of the US, united behind this idiot, is not a good sign. Which send shivers down my spine, as a lot of people are willing to follow this idiot, without thinking for themselves.

40. Posted by Herr Bert (Moderator 1384 posts) 9y

Quoting SeeTheSky

there's nothing practical that can be done.
maybe write a few letters to senators, and wait for a new election, but let's face it, the Governing process is so far from the reach of american hands that we are honestly helpless to the descions of fatrichwhiteopinionated men

And the world shakes it's head, when it sees, that it easy get an impeachment procedure started against a president who likes to smoke a cigar once in a while. But it is not possible to get rid of someone, who is clearly in over his head, and makes mistake after mistake.