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Anti-Islam movie by Dutch politician. Opinions?

Travel Forums Off Topic Anti-Islam movie by Dutch politician. Opinions?

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21. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 8y

Quoting Utrecht

The whole movie should be totally ignored by the media. Not only is there nothing new in the movie at all, basically all it says is that it is against islamic extremists, not the islam. Well, aren't we all?

You shoulda been a defence lawyer at Nuremberg 1945-1946
By that logic, WW2 had nothing to do with Mr. Hilter and the Einsatzgruppen had nothing to do with National Socialism.
The Cheka was actually an insurance company and not the murderous shield of Soviet Bolshevism, and the Spanish Inquisition was just a coupla likely lads aving a bita fun and the medieval Catholic Church is now absolved of all responsibility.
Islamic terrorism is a manifestation of Islam.
Join the dots.
Ghazali, Tamiyya, Wahhab, Maulani and Qutb.
Europe is rooted in the full sense of the Australian word.

22. Posted by magykal1 (Travel Guru 2026 posts) 8y

Quoting wotthefiqh

Islamic terrorism is a manifestation of Islam.
Join the dots.

....and by that logic ETA is a manifestation of the Basque people, and the UDA are a manifestation of the British. I'm glad you weren't a lawyer at Nuremberg, you would have hung the whole of Germany.

[ Edit: Edited on Mar 30, 2008, at 9:42 AM by magykal1 ]

23. Posted by Utrecht (Moderator 5596 posts) 8y

Quoting magykal1

Quoting wotthefiqh

Islamic terrorism is a manifestation of Islam.
Join the dots.

....and by that logic ETA is a manifestation of the Basque people, and the UDA are a manifestation of the British. I'm glad you weren't a lawyer at Nuremberg, you would have hung the whole of Germany.


No point to discuss with wotthefiqh, he is very lonely in his ivory tower

24. Posted by Herr Bert (Moderator 1384 posts) 8y

Putting a couple of violent pictures, and movies after another, doesn't do any justice to Islam. Yes, there are extreme forces, within Islam, I don't think anyone will deny that, but what this film is trying to say is: These are the extreme ways extremists deal with women, gays, atheists and people with a different religion, Expect that to be the future in the Netherlands within a few years.

Even if you would agree, with this false statement you would at least expect answers to this threat from a politician, but Wilders doesn't give any answer. This film is only made, to provoke Muslims, consist of mainly old and dated picture,s and also gives (often badly transcriped) outtakes of the Q'uran. If you only lift one or two sentences out of an entire verse, you are bound to end up with a twisted truth.

This film only confirmed my thoughts about Wilders, as a loud-mouth who only wants to shout, but is not able to give good solid arguments, and doesn't want to engage in debate. He only wants to have the votes from the 20-25% of the population, that have extreme rightwings ideas. nothing more, nothing less.

25. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 8y

Quoting Utrecht

Quoting magykal1

Quoting wotthefiqh

Islamic terrorism is a manifestation of Islam.
Join the dots.

....and by that logic ETA is a manifestation of the Basque people, and the UDA are a manifestation of the British. I'm glad you weren't a lawyer at Nuremberg, you would have hung the whole of Germany.


No point to discuss with wotthefiqh, he is very lonely in his ivory tower

Holy warriors justify their atrocities by quoting exhortation of violence from the Koran, mullahs preach hatred of non-muslims directly from the Koran and renowned? islamic scholar Sheik Yusuf al-Qaradawi (not allowed to enter the UK as he advocates the killing of homosexuals) has basically issued a religious justification for the murder of Wafa Sultan for what she recently said about Islam on Al-Jazeera television.
What 'holy text of violence' is Basque group ETA reading from, and do they have any verses like 'Spaniards are pigs and apes' to match the description of Jews in the Koranic Suras 2:62-65, 5:59-60, and 7:166?

By the way, did you follow the dots? Ghazali, Tamiyya, Wahhab, Maulani and Qutb.

Lonely in my ivory tower?
I've got so many people coming in the windows (20 - 25% of the Dutch according to Herr Bert) that I'm building a much bigger one.
Since when did defending democracy from theocracy become right-wing? What tosh

By the way, Pat Condell has a new and funny video on youtube about the release of Fitna.

26. Posted by arif_kool (Travel Guru 1757 posts) 8y

Quoting Herr Bert

Even if you would agree, with this false statement you would at least expect answers to this threat from a politician, but Wilders doesn't give any answer. This film is only made, to provoke Muslims, consist of mainly old and dated picture,s and also gives (often badly transcriped) outtakes of the Q'uran. If you only lift one or two sentences out of an entire verse, you are bound to end up with a twisted truth.

I agree with Herr Bert, quoting one or two sentences out of context can really twist the meaning....

In every community/religion there are such elements who thrive on spreading hatred amongst people. The same happens in India where a handful of disgrunted elements from the two major communities(Hindus and Muslims) disturb the communal harmony by provocative statements only to gain political mileage. The common man wants to live happily in peace and is mostly concerned about his bread and butter, nothing more than that

27. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 8y

So what exactly does the koran say about Christians and jews?

[ Edit: Edited on Apr 2, 2008, at 2:15 AM by james ]

28. Posted by arif_kool (Travel Guru 1757 posts) 8y

Wikipedia has a chapter on Critism on Islam, which states the following:

Quranic verse 62 of Surah Al-Baqara states:

"Those who believe, the Jews, Christians and Sabians - any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord. They need not fear, nor shall they grieve"

According to Suat Yildirim, Qur’an gave Jews and Christians a special and honored place. (Qur'an 29:46) [61]. Moreover, he states that Quran mentions that Christians were the "nearest to Muslims in love, because their priests and monks are not proud, and because they listen to and recognize the truth of what the Messenger (Muhammad) has brought (Qur'an 5:82-83)" [62]. - However, this does not account for Muslim-Hindu or Muslim-Buddhist relations. Karen Armstrong mentions that there are "far more numerous passages in Quran" which speak positively of the Jews and their great prophets, than those which were against the "rebellious Jewish tribes of Medina" (during Muhammad's time) [63].

The translated verses mentioned here can be found at the following link which has been compiled by the University of Southern California

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/029.qmt.html#029.046

29. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 8y

For a more realistic take on 21st century Islam, listen to The Grand Ayatollah Ahmed Alhasani al-Baghdadi.
He is one of the grand ayatollahs, the highest in the Shi'ite hierarchy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DkYe3sSDfA&feature=related

The first 90 seconds should give you the general idea.

or try http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHPt6ehelwA&feature=related

30. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 8y

Quoting arif_kool

Wikipedia has a chapter on Critism on Islam, which states the following:

Quranic verse 62 of Surah Al-Baqara states:

"Those who believe, the Jews, Christians and Sabians - any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord. They need not fear, nor shall they grieve"

According to Suat Yildirim, Qur’an gave Jews and Christians a special and honored place. (Qur'an 29:46) [61]. Moreover, he states that Quran mentions that Christians were the "nearest to Muslims in love, because their priests and monks are not proud, and because they listen to and recognize the truth of what the Messenger (Muhammad) has brought (Qur'an 5:82-83)" [62]. - However, this does not account for Muslim-Hindu or Muslim-Buddhist relations. Karen Armstrong mentions that there are "far more numerous passages in Quran" which speak positively of the Jews and their great prophets, than those which were against the "rebellious Jewish tribes of Medina" (during Muhammad's time) [63].

The translated verses mentioned here can be found at the following link which has been compiled by the University of Southern California

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/029.qmt.html#029.046

Fine. So what's all this about Christians being pigs, etc?

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