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Iran learns from USA

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51. Posted by BedouinLeo (Inactive 698 posts) 7y

I was an observer at a demo in Manchester a couple of weeks ago.
Quite an eye opener. The cops allowed facists and anti-facists to hold demos on the same day in the same part of the city.
The BNP shouted words of how they were going to mash the anti-facists on the day.
As it turned out, around 3,000 anti-facists turned up to march and the facists (EDL - English Defence League.. Pro Nazi) numbered about 80. The BNP didn't show at all.
Interesting though that the riot cops provoked the anti-facists more than the facists, even though the facists were using more threatening behaviour.
Hatred exists everywhere and sadly always will.

52. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 7y

There are a number of similarities between skinhead and ayatollah.
Both have suffered social, cultural, economic and educational deprivation, and you wouldn't invite either of them to a dinner party (unless they wore a Hannibal Lecter mask and were strapped securely to a gurney of course .)
The prime difference between their brands of fascism is that the ayatollah justifies his by islamic theology and practice whilst holding the levers of supreme power and oppression, but the skinhead has no state/religious support/fatwa and wouldn't recognise an ideological premise if it jumped up and kicked him in the wrinkled retainer (he just lurvs the biffo).

53. Posted by BedouinLeo (Inactive 698 posts) 7y

Are there two USA Politicians called Barack Obama? They look so alike to me, in fact identical in appearance.
One said, just over a year ago when he was seeking to be elected as USA President, that he intended to pull troops out of Afghanistan if he became President.
Today on UK television I saw another Barack Obama who looked exactly the same as the other guy, who's just proposed sending in another 35,000 soldiers and other military. The similarity in likeness between the two of them is just unbelievable.
Seeing is believing (or misbelieving, as the case may be).

[ Edit: Edited on 30-Nov-2009, at 12:24 by BedouinLeo ]

54. Posted by Isadora (Travel Guru 13926 posts) 7y

Quoting BedouinLeo

Are there two USA Politicians called Barack Obama? They look so alike to me, in fact identical in appearance.
One said, just over a year ago when he was seeking to be elected as USA President, that he intended to pull troops out of Afghanistan if he became President.
Today on UK television I saw another Barack Obama who looked exactly the same as the other guy, who's just proposed sending in another 35,000 soldiers and other military. The similarity in likeness between the two of them is just unbelievable.
Seeing is believing (or misbelieving, as the case may be).

One tends to forget that the events of a year ago do not always reflect those of present day. It's also very easy for the rest of the world to think that our President has the absolute last say. Not true. We have a two party system with checks and balances. Sadly, they are busy checking and balancing against most everything these days. It would be wonderful, if with the wave of the hand, Obama could pull everyone out of everywhere but, again, it ain't gonna happen for many reasons.

The US will be pulling troops out of Iraq over the next several months. Great. Seriously. I mean that "great". But, things have been escalating in Afghanistan on a monumental scale recently. Yes, I understand most will say it's because of our presence in the region. Maybe so, but it the consensus of the US advisors AND other nations that have brought Obama to his most recent decision. Unlike his predecessor, I have to believe that Obama actually listens to the advice, not only from home, but from abroad before making these decisions. (I could be totally wrong.)

As in your own country(s) - if you really pay attention to every campaign-related promise and sound-bite - you're going to be disappointed in the end. There is only so much any leader of any democratic nation can do (or not do) with the wave of the hand. Oh, besides greet the masses as they pass by.

55. Posted by BedouinLeo (Inactive 698 posts) 7y

Oh don't I know it? Your comments are good but nothing new in the world of politics.
Remember Bush's Daddy?.... 'No more taxes'. Within a year, they'd gone up and several new ones came in. Yes of course it doesn't just happen in the USA. Over here we were promised a referendum on the EU if Labour were re-elected. Has it happened? No.
The vast majority of the UK want us out of the EU. We want to adopt the Euro, yet 'Vote for me (or my b+*^*%it)', get me elected and I'll do it my way whether you like it or not once I'm in,' happens endlessly over here too.
It was just a raised point. I'm not suggesting in any way that Obama is any different to the rest of 'em. A bucket of broken promises is the norm for politicians globally.
35,000 more troops from the USA and another 500 from the UK.... Just means a little more looking over my shoulder than I used to. Scary stuff.

56. Posted by Isadora (Travel Guru 13926 posts) 7y

Damn, my broswer locked up as I was trying to edit and add this:

I know this has been asked before but I'm going to ask it again... What do you (anyone) propose we do? The options are:

1) Pull out of Afghanistan completely - hoping that it doesn't leave the innocent citizens in turmoil and at the mercy of the Taliban once they are on their own. (Maybe that won't happen but doubtful.)

2) Remain in place without scaling up troop numbers. (Which, with recent events would just have the Taiban killing off more innocents in their efforts to rid the country of already-existing Americans.)

3) Sit down for a nice cuppa and hope they like the scones. Seriously, I accept that Iraq is the folly of a former President but Afghanistan is a completely different kettle of fish. I wish neither had to happen.

I'm sorry Leo, but the world revolves around broken promises. Like you, I wish it weren't so but... You don't become a politician just because you want to make the world pretty again. Yes, it's scary stuff but then - so is my next door neighbor. Okay, I don't have a next door neighbor - they live half a mile away - he's still scary. ;)

57. Posted by BedouinLeo (Inactive 698 posts) 7y

I'm not proposing anything. I'm just making the point that Obama, like all his predecessors, made it up to get elected. When will the day come when the people elect a president or prime minister that stays true to their word? I haven't seen one yet.
Which way it goes in Afghanistan is not what I'm seeking to address.

58. Posted by wotthefiqh (Inactive 1447 posts) 6y

Iran's Christmas No 1 - Rage Against The Machine Regime

A regional representative of Iran's supreme leader said opposition leaders should be executed.
"Those who are behind the current sedition in the country are mohareb [enemies of God] and the law is very clear about punishment of a mohareb," state media quoted Ayatollah Abbas Vaez-Tabasi, an influential figure in Khorasan province, as saying.

The sentence for mohareb under Iran's Sharia law is death.
Why doesn't that come as any great surprise

Maybe the US should learn something from Iran

59. Posted by beerman (Respected Member 1631 posts) 6y

Quoting wotthefiqh

Maybe the US should learn something from Iran

Now there's an interesting concept. It rather makes me wonder what would happen if we Americans held to the same ideals. 2009 has been a year of absolute venom in the US. Granted, we generally don't send in Stormtroopers to quash demonstrations with bullets and tear gas (OK, maybe a little tear gas), but many people here are so ignorantly dissatisfied with the state of affairs that they lose all common decency and spout such venomous personal attacks. Can't we all just get along people???? Can't we be DECENT to each other????????

Former Vice President Dick "Who needs civil liberties" Cheney is back at it, foaming at the mouth while spouting that America is less safe from terrorists if we, basically, don't treat radicals like animals and keep them caged and uncharged on a lovely little island camp in the Caribbean. Sure, the radicals aren't American citizens, but should we suspend all we believe to be just and proper in order to "be safe"? To quote Benjamin Franklin, one of America's greatest womanizing, alcoholic kite-flyers: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

America would certainly be a different place if opposition parties routinely called for death to their enemies (and carried it out), and not a place I could call home. Fortunately, Americans are free to express their opinions without fear of, well too much, retribution. If only people would THINK prior to speaking.......because as they say, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, but you don't always have to show yours. At which point, I'll shut up......for now.

Disagree if necessary people, but try to be nice about it. Please?

60. Posted by eroltoksoy (Full Member 173 posts) 6y

Quoting wotthefiqh

I do envy today's high school pupils who study History.
I spent hours of utter boredom reading textbooks trying to grasp the ignorance, religious absolutism and violent oppression inflicted by clerics during the Middle Ages.
Now all they have to do is watch streaming video from Tehran to see it first-hand.

nice point. but I blame all religions for any kind of conflict.