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Same-Sex Marriages

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51. Posted by Tsunami (Full Member 35 posts) 11y

Quoting james

Quoting Tsunami

In my native country, Belgium, it's perfectly legal. I have one pair of homosexual friends in Spain, and they got married recently, so apparently it's legalised there as well.

My own stand is that any decent country should legalise it, what's wrong with two people loving each other ? To quote singer-songwriter Ani DiFranco (bisexual herself): "Love is genderless"

So about 99.9% of countries in the world are not decent? By the way, there's no law against two people loving each other anywhere, as far as I know....

- didn't say they aren't decent, I did say they should legalise it or at least consider it. That's just my opinion however.

- in some cultures being gay/lesbian is still a taboo and those who come out of the closet are in some countries even in danger. That's also why some travelguides for these places have a "gay/lesbian traveller" section about where they're safe to let it show and where not...

52. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 11y

Why should the other 99.9% of countries legalise it or consider legalising it? There are many countries who have a very religuous "culture", so why should they compromise their beliefs, traditions, laws and culture for the 2% of the population of the imperial West who might be homosexual?

Would you like these countries to force their views, traditions, religous beliefs and laws on your country?

Your arguments never seem to be very well thought out.

53. Posted by tway (Travel Guru 7273 posts) 11y

Quoting ChIqUiTtA

i think British Columbia and Ontario HAVE made it legal, while Quebec and Alberta have NOT made it legal... (just to name a couple...)

To clarify, same-sex marriange IS legal in Quebec, and the issue offers very little controversy here.

54. Posted by Brendan (Respected Member 1824 posts) 11y

Quoting james

so why should they compromise their beliefs, traditions, laws and culture for the 2% of the population of the imperial West who might be homosexual?

Homosexuality is not a trend of popularity. It has been around for thousands of years, if not from the very beginning. It is not an invention of the "imperial west". It has been in all cultures and countries in all ages around the world.

So, should everyone "legalise" it? It shouldn't even be an issue. How can anyone argue the legality of the union and comitment between people? Regardless of "culture", "beliefs", "nationality", "politics"... men have been loving men and women loving women for ages past.

Would you like these countries to force their views, traditions, religous beliefs and laws on your country?

Living in Canada I see just that coming from the United States, no offense to anyone, that is just the way it is.

Everyone forces their beliefs and views on everyone else, it has always been and always will be like that. So I guess what it comes down to is what you as an individual believes. The belief, "All people of this earth be protected by some basic rights and freedoms.". I believe this, there are many people who only half believe this, taking out parts they don't like.

In many nations to this day women have no "rights". No right to "vote" to work, to learn or to love as they see fit. Does anyone here believe that women should have no rights? That they are here to be dominated in a world controled by men? I doubt it... but you never know. If you do believe women should be free, do you not want to see women free all around the world? From that very same argument, homosexuals are denied rights and freedoms, and even killed.

How can the idea of freedom be categorised? Believe in the freedom of some but not others? Oppression is opression regardless of belief and religion and "culture".

  • deep breath*

okay, that will do

55. Posted by james (Travel Guru 4136 posts) 11y

Quoting Brendan

Quoting james

so why should they compromise their beliefs, traditions, laws and culture for the 2% of the population of the imperial West who might be homosexual?

Homosexuality is not a trend of popularity. It has been around for thousands of years, if not from the very beginning. It is not an invention of the "imperial west". It has been in all cultures and countries in all ages around the world.

So, should everyone "legalise" it? It shouldn't even be an issue. How can anyone argue the legality of the union and comitment between people? Regardless of "culture", "beliefs", "nationality", "politics"... men have been loving men and women loving women for ages past.

Would you like these countries to force their views, traditions, religous beliefs and laws on your country?

Living in Canada I see just that coming from the United States, no offense to anyone, that is just the way it is.

Everyone forces their beliefs and views on everyone else, it has always been and always will be like that. So I guess what it comes down to is what you as an individual believes. The belief, "All people of this earth be protected by some basic rights and freedoms.". I believe this, there are many people who only half believe this, taking out parts they don't like.

In many nations to this day women have no "rights". No right to "vote" to work, to learn or to love as they see fit. Does anyone here believe that women should have no rights? That they are here to be dominated in a world controled by men? I doubt it... but you never know. If you do believe women should be free, do you not want to see women free all around the world? From that very same argument, homosexuals are denied rights and freedoms, and even killed.

How can the idea of freedom be categorised? Believe in the freedom of some but not others? Oppression is opression regardless of belief and religion and "culture".

  • deep breath*

okay, that will do

Brendan, I don't recall saying that homosexuality was a trend of popularity nor an invnetion of the imperial west. The point I was making, and quite clearly I thought, was that I don't think the West should force it's laws onto other countries that don't want them.

Can I pose a question to you? You state that "How can anyone argue the legality of the union and comitment between people?". Does this include siblings? If not, why not? Is it somehow wrong? If so, why is it wrong? What about their so called rights? They love each other so you can't have a problem with that. Where is the line drawn between what is right and acceptable, and what is wrong, and why is it drawn where it is?

56. Posted by Brendan (Respected Member 1824 posts) 11y

You make a good point James. Siblings, should or should they not wed. Honestly I hold the same argument to that as well, how can laws be in place to stop being from being married. Be them man and man, woman and woman, brother and sister, father and daughter or any number of the combinations that can be brought up.

Marriage in basic forms, is the union of two people. If Siblings want to get married go right ahead, make no difference to me what so ever. Marriage is a "legal" way of declaring togetherness as spouses, people can marry their dog (or deer ;) ) or the bushes in their yard for all I care.

I think the problem you are refering two is siblings having sex and as a result having a child together? Is that wrong, well it would cause some strange things down the blood lines...

Perhaps, as a society we are too hell bent on controlling everthing and everyone around us. And if we can not control it, we fear it and cast it out of society. How are the lines of right and wrong drawn you ask? They are drawn by the self proclaimed elite. There is no right and wrong, only difference in opinion.

I am not sure if I stayed on point there or not, let me know.

57. Posted by Wocca (Inactive 3745 posts) 11y

You've made a good poitn about the siblings

58. Posted by Cupcake (Travel Guru 8468 posts) 11y

Quoting Brendan

Marriage is a "legal" way of declaring togetherness as spouses, people can marry their dog (or deer ;) ) or the bushes in their yard for all I care.

Step away from the deer, and nobody gets hurt! ;)

59. Posted by Tsunami (Full Member 35 posts) 11y

James, you honestly don't believe only 2 % of western population is homosexual, lesbian or bisexual ?? Put a zero after the two and you're not even there...

In my personal beliefs, everyone is potentially bisexual. Love is depending on more than the shape of a chest and genitals, to express it a bit blunt. Usually people fall in love with personalities, and you can have a strong inner bond with anyone you can connect to. I think many people exclude themselves from ever liking a person of the own gender because of cultural of social backgrounds. I believe though that love is genderless.
Everyone has a bisexual side anyway, maybe only few dare to express it or accept it. But I do believe honestly that love depends on things apart from gender.

And as a sidenote: in some countries you can legally marry an animal. In the US there's even a small business where you can hire a priest to marry you to your pet. In the same country however, some states still oppose against gay marriage... The US and political consequence has never been a good marriage though.

Post 60 was removed by a moderator