Places to visit in Europe.

Travel Forums Europe Places to visit in Europe.

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31. Posted by Sarahelainecp (Inactive 34 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

The question of good accommodation depends on your definition too. I've stayed in a lot of places in Scotland I would count as well away from major population centres, although maybe not by American standards, which I would also count as good. But that includes things like a 4 bedroom bed and breakfast in Durness (amazing home cooked breakfast, super friendly, views to die for, nice decor, comfy bed... but no pool,no gym, ropy wifi because of where it was, no restaurant) and Borgie Lodge (clearly unchanged since the 1920s except for enforcing the smoking ban, amazing restaurant featuring local produce, still has a smoking room (which is no-smoking) and a parlour - no gym, no pool, no wifi). Of course there are also immaculately restored 19th century spas in the Highlands (the glorious Crieff Hydro, for example), and some very modern ones. And I'm only going on about Scotland because I'm most familiar with it. Tourism is important throughout Europe - if what you want is a 5* spa half way up a mountain, googling "top 10 rural spa breaks Europe" will beyond a doubt turn up some spectacular places.

32. Posted by greatgrandmaR (Travel Guru 1499 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Back in the 60s (before the internet), when my husband was deployed to some foreign locale or when my parents traveled, I would make an itinerary for them, based on excerpting and consolidating information from travel books. I knew from extensive reading that Temple Fielding's books would concentrate on hotels where the bartenders could make a good martini (something none of us were interested in) and he didn't have much on the places to SEE that were there. Fodor and Frommer would be more interested in budget accommodations.

For my husband I did this so he would have some idea of what I thought would be good things for him to buy that I would like to have, and also so that if he had liberty he would have some idea of what would be good to do. When they were in Rota, Spain, he and four of his friends rented a car and went to Ronda, and Seville. I did not need to give him many hotel tips as he would be staying on the ship and also he didn't need transportation information from one place to another as a rule (no need for train schedules).

In any case - I didn't get the idea that the OP wanted gyms or pools or any kind of fancy place to stay because I thought he was asking for places where he could do some trekking. So I didn't think he would need a gym or a spa.

And as an USA American, I don't need a fancy place with a gym or a spa either although I do now want internet.

[ Edit: Edited on 25-May-2018, at 09:39 by greatgrandmaR ]

33. Posted by Sarahelainecp (Inactive 34 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Well, if you don't need that sort of luxury then there's almost nowhere in Europe you can't find a good place to stay. The internet has certainly made that easier to find - it used to be very much word of mouth. And in general standards have risen dramatically since I was a girl in the 1980s, let alone the 1960s - I remember clearly the days when hotels wouldn't let you back to your room between 10 and 5 even if you were staying all week. But definitions of "good" are very varied - I'd be careful which friends I recommended the aforementioned Borgie Lodge to, it would be about 50% "this place is fantastic!" and 50% "what timeworn hell-hole have you sent us to this time, you idiot?". And it's quite common on the big review sites to see Europeans praising a pretty, small old hotel and people from the USA, Canada and Asia complaining that it's lovely but the rooms are far too small/there's no lift etc, just from what people are used to. But I'd think it's quite possible now to pick a region or a small town or village first, then look for good accommodation - I've never had a problem with a definition of good that goes "near good food, clean, friendly, pleasant decoration, comfy bed and access to a decent bath or shower."

As an aside, my father spent quite a lot of time in Spain in the 1960s, but in the cargo ports- his crew would be routinely arrested for illegal gatherings because the police took the view more than four foreigners in one place away from the resorts was clear trouble. So he was sweating ink the first few times I went to Spain on my own, and all my attempts to explain that Franco was a long time dead and Spain was a rather different place now took a while to bite.

34. Posted by greatgrandmaR (Travel Guru 1499 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Bob and I were in Valencia in 1964 (he was on an aircraft carrier and I was following it around). But I think the Ronda visit was about 8 years later.

Because of mobility issues, I do now need an elevator although I can get along without it if I absolutely have to. But small rooms are not a problem - having spent some time traveling on a sailboat I find small rooms cozy. I just need to be able to walk from the bed to the door and I'd like easy access to a toilet and a place to put a suitcase.

35. Posted by woinparis (Inactive 145 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Quoting woinparis

-snip-
So.
You have been to Gent yet you think you know about Belgium and its landscape ?
Good ! You been to Flanders. You don't like flat country ? Ever heard that German army surprised french one by sending tanks in the Ardennes considered impassable because mountainous and full of hills trees etc. And the whole army was undetected because it was and is still hardly inhabitated ? Ever heard of the rivers Semois or Lesse where you go kayaking ?
Sure you are enticed to an opinion.
- snip-

Sure.
Andy is allowed to say what he wants and since he apologizes everything is fine.

Maybe you could have had the decency to write me a PM or Andy. As such, frankly, I don't know what to think of a travel forum where mods can say a whole country is not interesting since he went to ... one place.
And where moderation is to basically say 'hey, not everybody likes the same things'.
I certainly don't like the way you handled it, but I suppose you find it ok.

36. Posted by Sander (Moderator 5446 posts) 1y 2 Star this if you like it!

Quoting woinparis

Maybe you could have had the decency to write me a PM or Andy. As such, frankly, I don't know what to think of a travel forum where mods can say a whole country is not interesting since he went to ... one place.
And where moderation is to basically say 'hey, not everybody likes the same things'.
I certainly don't like the way you handled it, but I suppose you find it ok.

It looks like you deactivated your account after writing this, but in case you're still reading, and for everyone else:

I think you unfortunately have an unfounded impression of what it means here on travellerspoint to be a Moderator, possibly based on experiences with other forums, and are letting that color the way you interpret what has happened here.

I frequently half-jokingly (but also half-seriously) say that Moderators here really should be called "Janitors". We're around to clean up spam - and that's really it. Every other year or so, there might be a rare case of prolonged personal attacks and or sustained flaming, and a moderator might step in to tone it down a bit, but this is exceedingly rare, and generally we'll leave it to Peter to take real action. In all other matters, we're just regular users, with regular responsibilities. At a stretch you could say that we try to set an example with our behaviour.

I would describe Andy's lighthearted poke at Belgium as just friendly bantering. This is entirely okay here.

What might cause some frowning would be if he were to pop up in every thread even vaguely related to Belgium to try and convince potential travelers to stay away from Belgium. If he were to try and support his judgment with endless bad examples, and try to argue that everyone disagreeing with him was wrong. You know the type of argument - it's a common occurrence on many other forums to have people go off the rails like that. But this isn't what happened here, and in general it's not at all something which happens at travellerspoint.

And then, when you complained, Andy even had the good grace to apologize, and to clarify his remark.

-

As for the moderation on your comment. Since Andy said he wouldn't take action on it, and mojorob hasn't been seen in two years, Peter's the only one who could've done that. And sure, it would've been nice if he'd also sent you a PM the explain his reasoning for doing so. But y'know, he has a rather large workload as it is, and looking in from the outside, I wouldn't describe this as a situation which really warranted more explanation than what he wrote in his edit comment. It's a shame you took it as harshly as I think you did.

I hope you'll be able to get some distance from this, and maybe in a few days you can look at it all from a fresh perspective and consider returning here. The forum here might not function exactly as you expected it to function - but it does function very well. We tend to manage to both allow for disagreement and criticism and to retain a friendly atmosphere - and really, that's a great achievement, and something worth being a part of. :)

[ Edit: Edited on 27-May-2018, at 08:59 by Sander ]

37. Posted by AndyF (Moderator 1928 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Quoting Sander

I hope you'll be able to get some distance from this, and maybe if in a few days you can look at it all from a fresh perspective and consider returning here.

I agree, and Sander put it better than I could.

38. Posted by greatgrandmaR (Travel Guru 1499 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

I was the one who reported woinparis's comment as inflammatory. Which I think it was. The result that I saw was that there was a comment that it had been reported. I don't know what happened behind the scenes and I really don't care. It is not necessary that everyone agree, but it is necessary to take a disagreement with some kind of grace - especially since it was about a place and was not a personal attack.

39. Posted by Sander (Moderator 5446 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Quoting greatgrandmaR

I was the one who reported woinparis's comment as inflammatory. Which I think it was.

In the vein of what I said above about travellerspoint being okay with polite disagreement and criticism, I'd probably advise a bit of restraint with flagging comments as inflammatory as well. Absolutely use the reporting functionality if you ever come across heated or repeated personal attacks - and of course for any and all posts for promotional purposes - but since we're currently in the process of integrating three different communities with varying existing cultures and norms, there's bound to be some friction and re-learning how things work, and I'd say there's generally less harm done by leaving comments out then by hiding them until a moderator can review them.

40. Posted by Kathrin_E (Travel Guru 450 posts) 1y Star this if you like it!

Thing is, Sander, that some of us have known the poster in question from other forums.

I also reported, and I still think it is better to report and let a moderator check and decide if there is doubt about a post.

[ Edit: Edited on 27-May-2018, at 10:11 by Kathrin_E ]